Yamaha M7CL - Mic Pre amps, Voice Channels and ADCs ??

Has anyone out there used the M7CL with external mic preamps of any type ??

I did an A/B blind listening test with a Midas PRO6 and using a mic and CD player the Midas always sounded that little bit better.
Unfortunately I cannot justify the £46K (+$) on it at the moment on the Midas so I'm trying to improve my Yamahas if at all possible.
I suspect that the two biggest factors differentiating the sound quality are the Sample rates and the quality of the Mic Pre Amps.
The Yamaha M7's max is 48kHz compared to the Midas' 96kHz so I cannot do much about that, but what about the pre-amps ??
I used a TL Audio Ivory series Voice Channel and it did sound better but it still used the desk's analogue inputs.
Have any of you used the Yamaha ADCs like the 8 Channel one ( AD8HR) or the new 16 Channel things (SB168-ES) maybe with a CAT5 multi ?
Anyone used any kind of mic pre amp or voice channel into a Yamaha MY16-AT card fitted in the desk. (The ADAT I/O Card) ?
Has anyone used the Focusrite mic preamps ?
Octopre, Octopre 2, or the Focusrite ISA series.
Any other ADC mic pre amps in use out there with the M7 ??
I'd like to know how you got on and how it compared to using the desk's own mic preamps.

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Permalink Reply by Dorin on March 10, 2010 at 4:01am
Permalink Reply by Dan Anderson on March 12, 2010 at 10:08am
Wow - That is getting pretty complex !
Especially the talkback setup.
At the moment I have the M7CL and LS9.
I hear Yamaha are bringing out new digital desks later this year to compete hard with Midas and they already have the M7CL-ES out.
Anyone used the ES ? What about the pre-amps ?
Permalink Reply by Mike Harris on March 12, 2010 at 7:01am
An External clock...BigBen or NanosyncsHD will improve the converters....if you enter the Yamaha analog you will hear the benefit.
The most improvement would combine this with external pres

Maybe something like a True8>Apogee or Lynx>MY8AE....& utilizing the clock of the converter or ext clock
Permalink Reply by Dorin on March 12, 2010 at 9:37am
What about M7 Output, you will have only 44.1kHz, 48kHz his engine doesn't run out of 48kHz.
I would not recomend such investment.
What about DM2000 and you will get finest preamp and 96kHz IN/OUT.
I'm on my way to put my hands on it.
Permalink Reply by Mike Harris on March 12, 2010 at 9:49am
The My8AE card is bi-directional...as is the Apogee or Lynx. You would also have the benefit of better converters as well as 8 additional outputs

Prior to the M7/LS9 the DM2000 was a sensible choice...and the V2 software includes stuff to make it a bit more SR friendly...but the M7 was designed as a no layer reinforcement console...and it appears the initial poster either has or has access to that console

Both M7 & LS9 are 48k max
Permalink Reply by Matt Ferguson on March 12, 2010 at 1:49pm
Try running your Attenuators on every input channel (on the EQ strip) at -6 to -9dB, that will force you to drive your headamps hotter and essentially "use more bits."
Permalink Reply by Goat on March 13, 2010 at 8:17am
This is a bit like asking how you can get that 'Neve' sound out of your Garageband rig. You get what you pay for, and imagining that it is only the preamps that are compromised on that nasty little Yamaha console is painfully naive and shortsighted. You could start by not using any of the horrible M7 'plugin' compressors, bypassing the murky and grainy EQ section of each channel, and avoiding as much of the pretend 'DCA' routing nonsense. I would guess that turning off the little 'garageband' cartoon images of snare drums, saxophones, and whatnot, might help it's little computer brain do a better job of dealing with your audio signal path...
Good luck with that thing. I'll keep my eyes open for your listing on ebay in 2 years.
x
Goat.
Permalink Reply by Ketch Kelly on March 13, 2010 at 2:09pm
Goat
You have it right , The pre's are horrible thats that and no one ever asked for a Yamaha EQ , Comp , or Gate since 1982 if even then! So at the heart of the M7 or the Ls9 you have nothing that sounds all that good. Now when there were not options to them, then maybe it was an excuse to buy one but not anymore . We are about sound in the end so ask yourself does it sound good if you think so great. Just don't ask me to agree sorry for being harsh but Goat is right !!!Better a old analog desk that sounds good than a digital desk that is half way done. It starts with the pre amps then follows the signal path. To many people get digital to say they have one. Save enough cash to get a good one or don't buy now.
Permalink Reply by Dan Anderson on March 14, 2010 at 5:50am
Guys - You sound like a couple of gear snobs.
I've heard plenty of crap mixes out of Midas desks, even XL8s.
And I've heard loads of great shows on Yamaha digitals.

Your Comments - Not very helpful, and displays a lack of understanding of computer processing to say the least.

The person standing behind the desk is the most important component.
Permalink Reply by Dorin on March 13, 2010 at 12:24pm
M7cl isn't that bad. Its own preamp was designed with live environment in mind.
Targets:
- small/medium churches,
- small bands,
- medium business budget
- peoples that switching to one layer digital from analog domain

In my opinion M7cl and ls9 are really God's blessing for does peoples needs.
In live environment I would only recomand Ether Sound upgrade in place of spending moneys for expensive preamp which you can't take out maximum benefits from because m7cl was designed only with live in mind.
Ether Sound upgrade will gives you even an accurate sound fidelity.
I'm thinking also that peoples that invest in yamaha digital consoles will benefit continuous because yamaha offer support after market for their products. Please take example of new m7cl es as ether sound features as ether sound is compatible even with previous m7cl which now is m7cl v3.
Don't feel frustrated somehow and try to get the point of what you do. You are LIVE and M7cl is right beside you for that and for this task you didn't spend a fortune.
I wish you happy mix.
Permalink Reply by Goat on March 15, 2010 at 7:17pm
I am the absolute opposite of a gear snob - I am an actual working live sound engineer - out, touring, doing HUNDREDS of shows a year for over 15 years, and I am here to tell you that the Yamaha M7 is one of the worst sounding, most unusable consoles that I have EVER had the misfortune to stand behind. Really a horrible piece of gear. I would much prefer a Mackie 1604 - at least the little knobs do the stuff they are supposed to...
Permalink Reply by Mark Shotwell on March 15, 2010 at 8:08pm
I have mixed hundreds of events over the past few years on on M7 and Its ease of use, quality of sound, on board processing and price point make it a wonderful choice. In my situation, it replaced an aging 4K. I was able to to get 56 inputs with tons of on board processing for a very reasonable price.
Being that I am employed by a performing art center at a public University, budget was and is a big concern. The M7 provided us with a solid, good sounding mixer with a lot of built in processing.
That being said, yes there are nicer products out there and on occasion, I will rent a 5D or H3K but, for 99 % percent of what I do, the M7 is a great choice.

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